On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 9:56 AM, Miles Scruggs <asterisk@wideideas.com> wrote:
> I think there are some serious irrational fears about the public
> internet and misconceptions. In my opinion the only time you run into
> public internet problems is either last mile or poor planning.
Opinion, exactly... I am going to actually test with automated tools.
> The
> internet is like voice in that you can have multiple termination, but
> it gets better because you can also have multiple origination
> providers as well. So basically as long as you are buying high
> quality transit from multiple providers and you are located in a good
> data-center the chances you will experience problems is lower than if
> you are using private links because those represent single points of
> failure.
You completely disregarded the very simple fact that you can have
multiple private links. Not sure why you omitted that obvious fact.
You seem to know what you are talking about so the omission seems odd.
>
> I just ran into this with AT&T they currently only provide origination
> (for national did market access) over private t1 or DS3 circuits. If
> we had went with them they would have been our most unreliable route
> because they weren't over the public internet. We have yet to have a
> public internet related issue with any major provider, and AT&T seems
> to be the last player in the market to get it (they do provide
> termination only over public internet btw just not origination yet).
> I'm still a little burnt about the whole AT&T deal since they will not
> provide the service over ethernet, when we are literally 20 feet away
> from their cross connects, they want to build out a full DS3 with a
> managed router, but alas that is a story for another day.
I see no less reliability, you are getting a T1 or T3 (naming
conventions should be standard, so DS3 should be referred to as a T3)
from the carrier, point to point that terminates into their network.
How is that different as far as reliability than any other T1 or T3
other than it stays on network? Seems much more reliable than public
net.
>
> What I'm trying to say is that if you are trying to back haul your
> connections to some hole in the wall in timbucktwo then yes you'll
> have better reliability with PRIs since the telco seems to value those
> more. If you can build your network out right, then I would always go
> with the public internet, you never know when that one call could be a
> huge opportunity calling and I think I will stay with that viewpoint.
> In our case the internet has to become majority fractured before it
> would effect us vs a single wire on a single plug.
I don't really understand what you just said, even after reading it twice.
>
> btw Junction and most of these other carriers are just reselling Level
> 3 service anyway (which they also get over the public internet), so
> the only difference you are paying for is their ability to act as a
> proxy.
OK
>
> If you want some some circuits with unlimited channels we can provide
> those, just contact me off list depending on your commit we do offer
> unmetered origination as well.
>
> Cheers
Now it makes sense, you are trying to sell something. That is your
agenda and sales pitch. So who are you reselling?
Do you want to take part in the tests?
>
> Miles
Thanks,
Steve T
>
> On Jun 24, 2008, at 2:34 AM, Steve Totaro wrote:
>
>> OOOPS, I meant to say BUT, they backhaul the traffic on a highly
>> controlled network, not the "public" internet.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Steve T
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 5:30 AM, Steve Totaro
>> <stotaro@totarotechnologies.com> wrote:
>>> BUT,
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 11:20 PM, Jon Weisman <jweisman@ibell.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Steve,
>>>>
>>>> I get what you're saying about TDM, but most providers are
>>>> backhauling their
>>>> traffic via VoIP anyway. What I mean to say is even if you have a
>>>> PRI w/
>>>> some carrier they may very well be taking your traffic on that PRI
>>>> and
>>>> passing it along VoIP to complete the call.
>>>>
>>>> /jon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Steve Totaro" <stotaro@totarotechnologies.com>
>>>> To: "Commercial and Business-Oriented Asterisk Discussion"
>>>> <asterisk-biz@lists.digium.com>
>>>> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2008 10:19 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [asterisk-biz] VoIP Provider
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Maybe a bit of clarification about "Is it worth it?".
>>>>>
>>>>> I have always gone by the TDM to the outside world viewpoint. You
>>>>> never know when that one call could be a huge opportunity calling
>>>>> and
>>>>> I think I will stay with that viewpoint for at least a PRI or two.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would hate to lose a deal because of crappy call quality or the
>>>>> call
>>>>> never even hitting my switch. Sure, that could and has happened
>>>>> VERY
>>>>> rarely with TDM, I could count it on one hand with PRI on a circuit
>>>>> that has been turned up for a while and no change orders.
>>>>>
>>>>> At one point in a previous life, we were evaluating what call
>>>>> center
>>>>> to outsource our Spanish calls to. One of the contenders setup a
>>>>> conference bridge and the quality was terrible, then some random
>>>>> woman
>>>>> got on the call and kept saying "hola, hola, hola". This was a
>>>>> poor
>>>>> VoIP setup and made them look terrible. At least use a solid TDM
>>>>> connection for initial sales calls.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well I have signed up with Junction for testing and got a call
>>>>> from a
>>>>> gentleman named Tim within minutes of signing up. I already have a
>>>>> Vitelity account. I will sign up for Teliax and others that have
>>>>> contacted me on and offlist.
>>>>>
>>>>> I will probably setup a regular and also random dialout loop
>>>>> routine
>>>>> using many of the various VoIP providers and use Emperix Hammer
>>>>> with
>>>>> ULAW, recording any outages and the quality of voice.
>>>>>
>>>>> I still have a month and a half before my PRIs renew for a year and
>>>>> now Qwest is offering month to month (only because I put in a
>>>>> disconnect order) which will give me more time as well.
>>>>>
>>>>> The proof will be in the testing. 15mb up and down business FIOS
>>>>> with
>>>>> little to no traffic on the link other than VoIP traffic and server
>>>>> maintenance.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Steve Totaro
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Steve Totaro
>>>>> <stotaro@totarotechnologies.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Junction is a bit expensive (compared to others), the question
>>>>>> is, are
>>>>>> they worth it? Downtime or other issues?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>> Steve T
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 1:28 PM, Tim Panton <thp@westhawk.co.uk>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> I have been pretty happy with teliax.
>>>>>>> The only problems I have had are a _very_ occasional outage and a
>>>>>>> shortage of decent capacity to UK cell numbers at peak times.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They have a neat feature which lets you interactively get the
>>>>>>> rate for
>>>>>>> a number via a REST web service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I liked junction, but they only deal with US busineses, which
>>>>>>> probably
>>>>>>> won't be a problem for you and indicates a robust attitude to
>>>>>>> business:-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you have enough volume you might want to talk to paetech
>>>>>>> (spelling?).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Jun 18, 2008, at 22:10, "Steve Totaro"
>>>>>>> <stotaro@totarotechnologies.com
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Gafachi gives 10 outbound and $32/channel one time fee up to
>>>>>>>> 100,
>>>>>>>> beyond that, they want a wire transfer. Poor deal.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I will be looking at Teliax, Vitelity, and Junction Networks,
>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>> reviews?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is going on a FIOS business 15mb up and down. Bandwidth
>>>>>>>> shouldn't be an issues since nothing is really on this
>>>>>>>> connection.
>>>>>>>> Latency and reliability are obviously key.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am breaking my no VoIP outside the LAN rule, let's see how
>>>>>>>> it goes.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is time to either re-up on my PRIs for another year or go
>>>>>>>> VoIP (or
>>>>>>>> both if I can get month to month)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>> Steve T
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 4:42 PM, Geoff Love <GLove@teliax.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Teliax has a plan that will meet your needs. We call it the
>>>>>>>>> pay as
>>>>>>>>> you go
>>>>>>>>> plan and it can be set up with unlimited channels. Please visit
>>>>>>>>> Teliax.com
>>>>>>>>> and take a look at the Plans tab. It shows that we provide 10
>>>>>>>>> channels but
>>>>>>>>> we can easily expand that to unlimited.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We charge for usage and any DID's that you choose.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Teliax is now offering a revamped affiliate program too.
>>>>>>>>> Contact me
>>>>>>>>> offline
>>>>>>>>> and I can provide you with all of the details.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Geoff Love
>>>>>>>>> 303-629-8304
>>>>>>>>> Glove@teliax.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: asterisk-biz-bounces@lists.digium.com
>>>>>>>>> [mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces@lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>> Totaro
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 1:49 PM
>>>>>>>>> To: Commercial and Business-Oriented Asterisk Discussion
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [asterisk-biz] VoIP Provider
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am looking for a good quality provider with good rates to
>>>>>>>>> the US
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> Canada. My main concern is the number of simultaneous
>>>>>>>>> channels.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Gafachi has ten for outbound. Is there a provider that has
>>>>>>>>> "unlimited" and just bases cost on call destination and
>>>>>>>>> duration?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> Steve Totaro
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
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